Scams in the classical music industry and how to avoid them with guest Adam Clarke 

Michelle Lynne: Well, hey, everybody, and welcome back to the Fearless Artist podcast. I’m your host, Michelle Lynne. And today I’m very happy to have my friend and fellow Canadian Adam Clark on. Adam, welcome.

Adam Clarke: Hey, Michelle. It’s good to see you… thanks for having me on, huh?

Michelle Lynne: Oh my gosh, we’ve been talking about this episode forever. Today’s going to be a little bit different because we are actually coming together to share stories and possibly rant about scams that we have seen in the classical music industry. And it was actually you who suggested this idea for a podcast episode, and I thought it was brilliant. So that’s, we’re going to be diving in deep today.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, it’s gonna be fun. I think we’ve all had our fair share of people trying to offer us far too much when it seems too good to be true, and I guess it’s worth taking a look at that, right? So,

Michelle Lynne: Yeah, definitely. And I think people don’t talk about it so much openly. And I think this is a great place to start the conversations and also kind of make sure we’ve got each other’s backs in the sense of, “Hey, are you aware that this is a thing? Don’t buy into this lie. You know, don’t lose your money.” We’ll see. We’ll see where this episode goes.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, we can always add a bleep here and there, you know, and then we’re good to go…

Michelle Lynne: Um, first, I just wanna, I wanna comment, like, two Canadian accents. This is gonna be a really fun episode, so I’m looking forward. But, you are coming to us from Antwerp, just an hour away from me, in Maastricht. So, we’re both expats.

Adam Clarke: Yah… Ironically, you and I are from opposite parts of Canada. You’re from Alberta. I’m from Nova Scotia. Nova Scotia is like right near Boston for anybody that doesn’t know where Nova Scotia is. And now we’re in neighboring countries. And that was just sort of happenstance that we met each other. But, um, I’ll give you like a little background, quick intro, who I am, hear that, and then we’ll jump into the topics. Um, so I am a classical composer. But my niche is I mostly write for ballet and for dance. Um, I’ve done that since about 2016 here in Antwerp when I moved to Belgium. And now I’m moving into theater and developing my, my own pieces. When you’re writing for ballet and dance, you are often the, I don’t know, it’s like writing for film, you know, you support the narrative that the choreographer or the director wants to bring forward. So that’s what I’ve done. And long story short, everyone says, “Why Belgium? Belgium is, I think, one of the best kept secrets in Europe for

Michelle Lynne: Art… Ooh.

Adam Clarke: Yeah,

Michelle Lynne: Okay.

Adam Clarke: Really. Because Antwerp, everyone drives through Antwerp to get to London, to get to Paris, to get to Rotterdam, to get to Amsterdam. And there’s a, a, a huge support for culture within Flanders, specifically in Belgium as a whole and population density. So that’s what brought me here initially, right? So, guitar album with Four Aces Guitar Quartet led to my master’s degree. I wrote music for some of the dance performers at the Conservatory. And then some dancer from the Ballet Flanders, Opera Ballet Flanders said, “Hey, I like what you do; come and write something for me.” And that started the whole trajectory of composing for dance. Um, and

Michelle Lynne: That’s amazing, Adam.

Adam Clarke: Yeah,

Michelle Lynne: That.

Adam Clarke: Like we met because of Dimitri, and Dimitri was introduced to me via by someone I studied with, and now we collaborate a lot and now you and I are starting things together as well, which is a lot of fun. Uh,

Michelle Lynne: Yes.

Adam Clarke: Here we are.

Michelle Lynne: Yeah, and it’s amazing to see how we’ve been able to connect and introduce, I mean, I had no idea, like a fellow Canadian, only an hour away, pursuing a portfolio career, multiple divisions, disciplines, it’s amazing that we finally got to meet each other. And what you’re saying about Belgium, I was, I had a day off yesterday in Brussels, and I was just… admiring, like we tried to go to the fine arts museum. It was closed. It was Monday, but I was realizing again, like actually, uh, Brussels has such this like eclectic, creative vibe. And I think that there’s so much depth kind of hidden. You have to kind of know where to be, where to go to meet. Um, otherwise I’m just going through Brussels to get out of there. You’re right.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, exactly. Don’t ever drive in Brussels on a Friday. If, uh, if you have a death wish, it’s a great, great decision. Uh, but yeah, no, Brussels is a really dance-centric city. And I agree with what you say. Helps to really know people. And I think that these, these opportunities and these scams that we’re going to talk about, um, it’s

Michelle Lynne: Opportunities in quotation marks. Yeah,

Adam Clarke: just wrote it down in quotations over here as well. So,

Michelle Lynne: Yeah, yeah.

Adam Clarke: It’s better to invest in the folks that are in your artistic community than it is to take a chance on some random email. Um, and so. We’ve

Michelle Lynne: Oh, man.

Adam Clarke: our time come across so many of those. Right.

Michelle Lynne: I mean, just briefly, like we love hearing about how careers open up as we take action. So it’s incredible that you, like, committed coming over, you did your master’s, and then somebody says, “Hey, I like what you do. Let me introduce you to this whole new world for you,” right? And now that’s become like a major part of your career. And I think, uh, the second part of this episode, we want to talk about grant writing, which is something that you are like super really highly skilled in. And I really appreciated how you told me you developed that skill to facilitate your creative pursuits, projects. And I just thought that is the Fearless Attitude 101. I love hearing about people taking action like that. Like, “Oh, we need money to fund the project. Okay, I’ll learn how to write grants really well.” It’s like, wow, that is such a victorious mindset—action taking. I love hearing that we’re not victims. We just figure it out. We get her done. My Canadian accent is coming out!

Adam Clarke: We get her done.

Michelle Lynne: We get her done! Oh my gosh, I’m excited. Okay, so Adam, please, you pitched me actually this idea last summer already. You, uh, sent me a voicemail, a ranty voice message about something that happened to you. Um, which I love receiving ranty voice messages. Um, so please, can you walk us through what happened?

Adam Clarke: Yeah, yeah. This one’s good fun. Um, at first when you run into these opportunities, you get… to get upset. Now I just kind of have fun with them because I’ve been able to identify them. And I think it really helps to be able to, to, you know, read through and poke some fun at it. Right? And so,

Michelle Lynne: Right.

Adam Clarke: I emailed…

Michelle Lynne: It’s like when the telescammers call and you’re like, trying to keep them on the line as long as possible, right? Yeah.

Adam Clarke: That sort of a thing, you know, um, nah, I, I got an email last summer and I think Dimitri also got an email from them at one point. And,

Michelle Lynne: I think I did as well. Yeah. Yes. Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: A company based in Switzerland. And, uh, what we want to do is, you know, we’re going to just talk to theater houses across Europe and we really love your vision, blah, blah, blah. Do you have time for an hour-long call? And I’m like, “Oh, I’m open to just have the call.” I was curious, right? Of course, it felt very scammy at first, but I wanted to see who

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: were and they actually got

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: a call with me. It’s like a Zoom and I was chatting with them and they said, “Yeah, you know, so you read through the contract and blah, blah, blah. And, uh, there’s no guarantees, but, uh, you know, we will do our very best to sell whatever your work is.” And the first thing I asked him is like, “So what do you know about me?”

Michelle Lynne: Mm.

Adam Clarke: Good job at actually researching who I was and what I do.

Michelle Lynne: Okay. Okay.

Adam Clarke: Like, that was a yellow flag, we’ll say. But,

Michelle Lynne: Okay.

Adam Clarke: next thing was the CEO of this company was speaking to me and I said, “So, okay, so your partner, your friend here is from Romania. Uh, your colleague here is from Romania. I lived in Bucharest, spent a lot of time there. Uh, so where are you from? Are you also from Romania?” And she’s like, “No, no, I’m from, I’m from London. I grew up in London.” And I was like, “Uh, she spoke with a very thick Eastern European accent.” So it was like one of the—I was like, “Okay, this is hilarious.” And so I said, “Okay, just send the contract. I want to see what it looks like.” And they had a clause in there that was like, “You have to pay us a fee. I think every quarter for us”

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: these people, but we guarantee no results and any work that you do for the next five years, you need to pay a percentage to us.

Michelle Lynne: Insane. And that’s work that they don’t necessarily get you. Just anything that you do.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that’s why it’s important to read through your contracts, right? But it, I just wanted to go into depth, but, and see it went. I don’t know what the experience is like for you. Did you

Michelle Lynne: I had a very similar email. I remember it being flattering. Like, “Oh, we have found you and we love what you’re doing. And then we would love to represent you.” And I mean, I think that they know how to play into your emotions because most musicians feel isolated and we feel alone and we just want someone to do the work for us. I mean, we have people on our membership and they’re like, “I’m spending more time on my computer than at my instrument. It’s pissing me off.” Um, so when you have someone write to you and they’re like, “Listen, we will pitch 10 concert venues for you per month.” I think they said I’d pay 200 a month or something. Like, they had different packages that they were offering me. And I looked into it, you know, I searched their website and stuff. I’m like, “‘Cause maybe this is something that’s worth investing in.” ‘Cause if they book you a gig, like the fee’s higher than 200. Okay, boom, this is ROI. Like this is how it works. But then you start digging in, talking to people. “Have you got this email?” Yeah. Okay. We all got it. Okay. Fine. Of course, they need to pitch multiple musicians, but then you look at the roster of artists that they have. This is something else that they’ll do. They don’t send a tailored, personalized pitch to a venue saying, “Hey, this artist, you know, Adam has this specific theater production coming up that would fit because X, Y, Z.” They’re, they’re not really working to create this kind of collaboration. They will send an email with all 10 or 20 of their artists and they say, “Pick one, pick one of our artists to book at your theater.” And that’s what they’re counting as one of the 10 pitches per month that they send you. They’re doing kind of these mass email pitches and it’s like, “Well, you could take your 200 a month and just sit at your computer and do that yourself, and then maybe have a better shot because it’s more personalized and coming from you.”

Adam Clarke: That’s, that’s something, you know, if you’ve ever sent emails to venues, especially at least in my experience, I started a dance theater company with a choreographer a couple of years ago. We since moved on, but in the process of creating these pieces together, you have to send out like so many emails to venues

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: and the booking people, like the producers, they’re so busy and they get so many emails that you…

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: might not get an answer. So if they pitch like these 20 artists to all these folks, the likelihood that they will even read the email—especially like me or yourself or anyone that’s come across this enough times—you’re a bit allergic to it. And I feel like if I was a programmer, I’d be like, “Yeah, I’m not looking at this.”

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm. Yeah, right. Yeah, they do receive so much. And I think what’s the most upsetting is that they would take 20 percent of anything that you do, regardless of if they— you know, when they don’t guarantee results and then they say we take 20 percent of everything. I mean, for me… my candlelight contract is something completely separate from any of my, you know, let’s say pure classical concert. So I would never put myself in a position where I’m somehow paying my candlelight concert fees to another organizer who has nothing to do with that. And that’s something that I’ve been building for three years with a completely different group of people. I mean, at what point, like, we have to protect what we’ve been building and boundaries and—I hate that they prey on the vulnerability and the emotion of the artist who just wants to have the manager, you know, teaching it… entrepreneurship, you know, the students are saying, “Well, I just would really like a manager because then they’ll do that for me. They’ll take care of me. They’ll get me to gigs and I can just practice and show up.” And I’m like, “Yes, like, I really hope that that works for you.” But even when we talk to people who have management, it doesn’t always go that way. So we have to be like aware of what’s possible.

Adam Clarke: You got to build your own career and build a name for yourself where your manager, if you decide to get one, or even like a publisher as a composer, you need to have a career that’s already invested in and started moving, and then they can work with that, but they can’t take it from nothing. You know, it’s, it’s really—and I’m not saying you’re just because you’ve not performed a lot that you’ve done nothing—it’s, there’s a lot of work that goes in before you even get like the first couple of gigs or even start gaining a reputation. So that must be really interesting for you teaching the entrepreneurship class. I am a bit removed from that world a little bit. So what, what was your general consensus when musicians show up into your entrepreneurship class? Do you see a lot of folks? Do they ever bring any of these sort of scams, opportunities, or

Michelle Lynne: They’re, I mean, I’m teaching year one right now. In year two, so they’re 18, 19… like, for them, it’s just all their whole world is practicing and they just want to— I mean, they just moved out of their parents’ home. And so they’re not really at this level. Um, but where we do see it is with the Fearless Artist. So in our membership calls, like people will bring stuff, which, um, someone recently had won a competition. So get this, this is another big scam. By the way, on Instagram Stories yesterday, I asked people to share their own experiences. So we got a few responses, and this was one of them. So he, he wins first prize at this competition. It was an online thing, and they say, “Guess what? Part of your prize, you get to come play in Carnegie Hall.” Okay. Amazing. Put it on the resume, get to go play in Carnegie. Amazing. Turns out he gets five minutes on stage and he needs to pay 1,500 to play. So he came to our call and was like, “Guys, what do I do? Is this worth it? Is it worth it for me to be able to say I’ve performed at Carnegie?” And we’re like, “How do we even start?” Like, first of all, it is just so rude for them to take advantage. And again, if you’re going to fund a competition, I understand that putting on competitions costs a lot of money. You got to fund that, you’ve got to pay your jury. You’ve got to pay for the tech if it’s online. I mean, of course there’s a budget involved, but to put it on the artists that you’re then trying to promote and like, there, it’s just, it’s just insane. So we, we had a big conversation about it and we tried to get all the details and make sure. And then finally, I think the person decided that it wasn’t worth it for them to, you know, because then on top of the 1,500, you got to fly to New York, get your hotel paid. I mean, it was going to be like three, 3,000 for him to get five minutes on stage in Carnegie. So that was upsetting to me because I felt like he was being taken advantage of.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, I agree. It’s, it’s tough. Um, I think that sounds to me like the right decision. I mean, if you have three grand to put into doing something for five minutes at Carnegie, I think honestly you might as well put three grand into doing something that might more directly benefit your career and your artistry within the circle that you sort of exist in or you want to expand out of. Um, I’ll give you a great example. My first composition professor, Derek Chark, um, a Juno Award-winning composer, one of my favorite people ever. I really love Derek. Um,

Michelle Lynne: Great.

Adam Clarke: He gave me a couple pro tips as a composer, and one of them relates to this. And it’s sometimes it’s better to be accepted at a lesser-known university… and get the opportunities to have your music performed by visiting ensembles or an orchestra or, or anything else, as opposed to going to a school like the Manhattan School of Music or Juilliard, where if you’re not like the top, top, when you just get into your bachelor one, you’re going to lose out on all these other opportunities, um, for growth. And I thought this was a really interesting point. Would you rather have the five minutes at Carnegie Hall, which is the, the big name, or would you have more opportunity within your own sphere. And I think, I think that’s a really wise decision on behalf of your, your Fearless Mastermind. Uh, member there.

Michelle Lynne: Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for, thanks for bringing that up. That’s a great point. And I think somebody did say like, “Put that 3k into, you know, making a music video of your recent recording or like doing some genuine marketing for yourself or, I mean, even hiring a marketer who’s not going to use you,” you know, um, you had one that you wanted to talk about—a call for scores.

Adam Clarke: Oh, oh yeah. Call for scores. Uh, actually this turned out to be pretty good for me, this one. Uh, but it’s… ‘cause Canada Council is, um, I got a grant for, no, it wasn’t Canada Council. It was the Nova Scotia Talent Trust… this is like 2016 and I was accepted to do some sort of an ensemble residency in Eastern Europe. And I got accepted… great. I got the grant application submitted and got my first chunk of cash from NSTT, uh, thanks to them, by the way, um, definitely support NSTT. If you want to support arts in Nova Scotia, they’re awesome. And I read the contract and it said, “We own your music.” It’s like, nah,

Michelle Lynne: Uh, okay.

Adam Clarke: I just went on Facebook and I was like, “Hey, does anyone have a residency that I can attend?” Uh, and it turned out, um, a friend of mine, Jasmine—uh, Jasmine, uh, works quite a lot with, with John William Watson… if you don’t know John William Watson as a choreographer, uh, they are awesome. Uh, so check them out…

Michelle Lynne: Okay.

Adam Clarke: Anyways. Uh, she’s like, “Hey, yeah, I know one in Crete. Um, it cost less than what your thing

Michelle Lynne: Oh, I love Crete.

Adam Clarke: is.” And so I called up NSTT and I said, “Hey, yo, uh, you know, let me—do you mind if I go do this?” And, uh, it was brilliant. I got to work with dancers. Uh, I got to learn to play, uh, Cretan folk music, um,

Michelle Lynne: Oh, wow.

Adam Clarke: Beautiful, and it ate the freshest watermelons and tomatoes ever. So if you can identify your scams and then redirect yourself towards something that’s even better or find something, um, kind of like this opportunity, I think it can really—the scams are not necessarily a bad thing so long as you can identify them, because it helps you refine what is a good opportunity. I think that maybe is a bit of a benefit.

Michelle Lynne: Yeah. Good for you for reading these contracts. I also had like a manager in London approach me and it seemed like he wanted to break into the music world. He had some contacts and like, I don’t know, racing cars or something. He was kind of like an affluent person and he wanted to like support musicians. And so, you know, we had like chatted a bit and you want to give people a chance—the benefit of the doubt. And then he sent over the contract and it was just like, again, taking of anything that I did, including like photo shoots, modeling opportunities, singing, uh, as well as piano. And it’s like, “Whoa, whoa.” Like, you were telling me you were going to get me some piano concerts in London. You have nothing to do with like my dress brand deals or like my, my original songs that I’m performing. Like, how is this—everything kind of gets conglomerated. Unless you’re like, you’re saying we own your music. Excuse me. Like, where did this, you’re come from?

Adam Clarke: Nah.

Michelle Lynne: No, no, you don’t. No, you don’t. Right. Okay. Here’s another one that I think comes through a lot, and it’s the dead husband piano scam. Have you heard about that? I’ll just read the email.

“Hello. No name. I hope this finds you well. I’m a widow whose husband had a passion for music but never went pro. So sad. I have a Yamaha grand piano belonging to my late husband. By the way, husband is capitalized every single time. I don’t know why. Uh, for adoption. She wants someone to adopt her husband’s piano. I’m looking to give away my late husband, again, all caps, grand piano to a loving home music school. Just let me know if you would like to have the piano or know anyone who would appreciate the instrument. I look forward to hearing from you. Where city are you? Kind regards.”

Adam Clarke: “City are you?” Indeed.

Michelle Lynne: Where’s the, are you—where’s city? So anyway,

Adam Clarke: Antwerp. Yeah, yeah.

Michelle Lynne: Exactly. I think so. What I’ve understood is they offer to send you this piano and then they ask for you to pay the shipping or something, and so you send them the shipping costs, and then either they ghost you. Another one is that you like overpay them somehow, and then they’re like, “Oh, we’re going to send you the money back.” But then they… they never send you, or no, sorry, it’s that they send you the fee. That’s the birthday kid song scam, which is the next one that I have. So, um, they’ll say, “Hi, I love your music. Can you write a song for my son? His birthday is next week. I went through your page. I think I just fell in love with your music. I would just love a simple birthday song, which has his name in it. I would pay you 200 bucks if that’s okay.” And so you’re like, you know, you check the profile, there’s some pictures. Okay. He wants to write his kid a birthday song. That’s kind of nice. Support young artists. Okay. You know, and again, and so the scam is that he would overpay the 200 bucks. He would send 400 or something, and then he would say, “Oh, can you send me back the, what I—the too much amount that I paid? 200.” And then the initial 400 payment just wouldn’t go through, or he would block it or whatever. So then you’re out 200 bucks. So those two things, and it’s kind of obvious to musicians, I think. However, like, they also sent that email to my church. And so my poor sweet secretary emailed me, and she’s like, “Oh, Michelle, like, look, they want to donate a piano to our church.” I’m like, “No, they don’t. No, they don’t.” Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Adam Clarke: One, um, yesterday. Okay. This one is a gray zone, so it might not be a scam per se, and I don’t think it necessarily is, but I think it is something to be wary of. Uh, and you might better invest your money elsewhere. So, singer. From Belgium, a friend of mine went to a competition, uh, some singing competition in another European country that will remain unnamed. And there are several hundred applicants, uh, that are accepted there, not just chosen to show up, but 400 of, I don’t know, however many people that applied in the first place, with an application fee of 120 euros.

Michelle Lynne: Yikes.

Adam Clarke: They choose 20 people out of those 400 who are going to be the, I don’t know, the winning sopranos or tenors or whatever, whomever’s singing. And my more skeptical side thinks if there’s a competition that’s worth doing, they would have a lower application fee. Like 30 euros is something that I can get behind because of course competitions do have their costs and you do need to cover it. However, I think an exorbitant fee, like 120 bucks a person—I feel,

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: a fundraising round. Uh,

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: and I could be wrong, right? So don’t

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: take this for gospel, but the fee, my feeling I get is, is exactly what you said. They’re trying to get money out of these artists that are, you know, they’re trying to build a career, and you

Michelle Lynne: Artists need the money.

Adam Clarke: give people hope on a stick, you know, it’s

Michelle Lynne: Yes.

Adam Clarke: hook and go.

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: For it. You know, they’ll chuck the money. They’ve got the flights, they’ve got the hotels and the food, and then they’ve got either the, you know, one out of the 20 people or the disappointment of not reaching that. And I think competitions are important. If you were going down the competition route, I don’t know very much about the world, but my understanding is that you train to present in a certain way within a competition setting, and thus you will get access to different levels of your career, totally viable. Um, but I don’t think it’s the only way. And this is the thing I really like about what you do with the Fearless Mastermind is you teach folks to look at themselves, identify what sort of interesting combination of skill sets they have in order to lead a career that is theirs, an individual and not some follow-copy-paste thing. And it’s okay if you follow a regular route—if you go play in an orchestra, if you love it, hell yeah, go for it. But I love that you give people another option. Um, because this is the way that I’ve had to go to, and I’m all the more grateful for it. So,

Michelle Lynne: Yeah, I don’t know. I know. I totally agree with you that the application fee. And then, uh, some people who wrote in yesterday via the Story said, once you win the competition money, you then have to pay taxes on it. Um, one of our flutists wrote in—she had to, uh, was told to pay 10,000 to participate in an orchestral festival that you quote, “need to be successful.”

Adam Clarke: What?

Michelle Lynne: Yeah, I know. And then she also, uh, submitted, somebody wanted her to pay 1,000 for lessons, or they wanted to pay her 1,000 for lessons, but she had to wire the extra money to their dying wife abroad.

Adam Clarke: It’s the Nigerian prince, you know?

Michelle Lynne: Yeah. Um, someone else came in and said, uh, agents again, getting a percentage of your bookings, even if they didn’t book that gig. So similar to what we already shared, um, paying tax on a competition prize money after paying to be in the competition. And then somebody said the biggest scam is the one that you talk about at the Fearless Artists, which is that college degrees don’t prepare you for the industry. And that is a whole other topic of—but I mean, Chris still, who’s from Honesty Pill—he also said if you’re paying 40,000 a year for, uh, US education and they’re not training you how to take auditions. I mean, he was like very, much against that. That’s why he’s come up with this whole, uh, accelerator audition course. But also for us, like if they’re going to shoot you out into the world and don’t tell you what it’s going to be like on the other side, or like help prepare you to earn income, and then they just come back with numbers of like, “Oh yeah.” And you know, most musicians are at poverty level after finishing their degree—it’s like, “Yeah, well, you need to help prepare your, your students.” Of course, like conservatories have so much to teach us already with like actually just being skilled at our instruments. I mean, it’s a lifelong quest, of course, but also there should be like a sense of responsibility that we need to prepare them to actually be able to earn a living, so that they can continue doing this thing that they’re paying for.

Adam Clarke: Absolutely. I mean, uh, how many folks have you graduated with? Are still pursuing music? And if they stop pursuing music, how much of it is due to not being able to make a living wage from

Michelle Lynne: a living. Yeah.

Adam Clarke: navigate it? It’s, it’s, it’s insane. I think maybe I

Michelle Lynne: I would love to know the numbers.

Adam Clarke: I can count on one hand and

Michelle Lynne: That’s true. And of course, like, you know, life—yeah, there just has to be more preparation for, you know, you know, people get families, you know, a lot of my female friends are moms. Well, how are you supposed to—okay, then you need childcare if you want to practice. Well, then who’s paying for the childcare? Like, and then if, you know, your husband’s at work all day or whatever, I mean, these—these are reasons why people stop performing, uh, or just, you know, gigging and being all over the place. The travel that’s involved to be in these different places. I mean, there’s so many logistical reasons why a career like this is just really hard to figure out on your own. And then on top of it, you have low-paying fees or people only offering a few hundred bucks for like three rehearsals in a concert. It’s like, this is just not possible. Okay. A couple of other scams I wanted to mention, um, on this segment is, when I started releasing my own songs, um, I got a lot of people saying like, “Oh, let us help you get Spotify streams. So, you know, pay us a hundred bucks a month and we’ll boost your streams or whatever.” So obviously that’s all bots and it would just, like, tank your engagement. And I follow a really great guy on Instagram, Venture Marketing, Dustin from Venture. And he talks a lot about, like, the risks associated with, like, shooting up your streams, Spotify banning you,

Michelle Lynne: And anyway, big mess. And also buying Instagram followers. A lot of people have in the past paid like 15 bucks to have, you know, a bunch of new followers that turn out all to be again botted or people—what I’ve seen is they’re real accounts, but they’ll like agree to follow because they’ve been signed on to this whatever that they—they’re told to go follow all of these accounts that have come into the thing. I did receive a pitch that, um, I bought into a year ago that ended up being a scam, and they wrote me a very specific, compelling pitch. They were like, “Hey, Michelle, like, we’ve looked at what you said about how they had done their research for me too. We love what you’re teaching about entrepreneurship. We see you also have a performing career, blah, blah, blah. This is how we can boost you. You know, you’re not getting enough visibility and like your content deserves to be seen by more people.” And you’re kind of like, “Yeah, man, I worked so hard for this content.” And like,

Adam Clarke: it was like a hundred bucks a month. And then they were supposed to like organically do engagement. And then in the end, I think it was just that they were getting bots to come on and like the page or follow me back or whatever. And so then I wrote them, “I’m like, hey, I want a refund,” which was promised in their terms and conditions. And they’re like, “Oh no, because you didn’t tell us in this way or this timing or whatever, there was something.” And I was out a hundred bucks and I was also very mad. Another scam to avoid.

Adam Clarke: Of one of those things I, um, uh, attend some events. Um, we went to a gala in Brussels a couple of months ago and there was someone that we met there, and I went to their Instagram, you know, you just want to see who, you know, in common or what they’re up to. And they’ll see like 12,000 followers, 13,000 followers. And then when they post a reel or they post a photo, it’s like seven likes, eight

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: Like, “Ah, okay.”

Michelle Lynne: Exactly. Yeah. Very good.

Adam Clarke: Don’t do that to yourself. You’re scamming yourself there.

Michelle Lynne: That’s a good point. Um, one last one I wanted to share is, I got, uh, a PR woman who wrote me and said, “Hey, we’d like to feature you in an article in LA Weekly around top 10 entrepreneurs that we have found, you know, in the music world.” And she was a real person and we chatted, and I was, and so the—basically they’re selling spots into this article. So for 500, I could be one of their 10 entrepreneurs featured in LA Weekly. And it was all, you know, I did my research. It was all legit. So then I was like, “Is it worth it for me to essentially put 500 towards marketing to get into this article?” And then she lists like all of the other publications and how you can use that as leverage to get seen by other bigger media and stuff. So what I ended up doing was I looked up previous articles that she had done and I messaged those people on Instagram and I said, “Hey, like, you don’t know me. I liked three of your posts and I left a nice comment,” and they had big followings—like some of them were like two or 300K. And I said, “I would just really love to know if you thought that this opportunity—opportunity,” quotation marks,

Michelle Lynne: was it worth it for you? And like, surprisingly, like three or four of them answered me back and they’re like, “Yeah, it brought us nothing.” So I was like, “Thank you so much for saving me 500.” So for everyone listening, like if you do think something might be worth looking into, just do your research and talk to other people who have done it. You know, Google is your friend. Um, don’t ever jump into something without really like checking both sides of the street before you cross, ‘cause, you know, I would like that 500 bucks in my pocket.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, for—

Michelle Lynne: as you’re saying, putting it towards something that can actually help.

Adam Clarke: Well, yeah, it’s, it’s, I think what you’re saying, especially with folks listening, is everyone has run across some form of this sort of scam or opportunity, uh, in their career. And I think the best thing to do is just kind of have a toolkit of how to evaluate these things properly. And it’s exactly what you said. You got to look both ways before you cross the street. You got to talk to other people, for instance, within your mastermind. Uh,

Michelle Lynne: Hmm.

Adam Clarke: You bring everyone together, and also you, you go talk to industry professionals or people that you respect and say, “Hey, listen,”

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: “Would you ever do stuff like this?” Like there’s some folks that you might look up to, um, that might seem out of reach, but honestly, be surprised how much people like helping folks with small little favors. Maybe just quickly, I’d love to touch on a couple of things that I think people can focus on instead.

Michelle Lynne: Yes, please. This is exactly what we need.

Adam Clarke: Instead of saying no to scams, maybe here’s some actionable material. There’s a couple of big things. The number one thing for me, aside from being proficient at whatever your practice is—whether it’s composing or playing piano—is showing up. And what do I mean by showing up is these people that you want to work with—they need to see that you’re active in the scene. So this is like the…

Mm.

I grew up playing heavy metal, and the heavy metal scene was—you knew each other and you got introductions to people because, you know, “Oh yeah, this band, yeah, they opened for us down in, uh, in Berwick.” So you’re bringing them up to Halifax, and, you know, and I think this thing still happens today and I, I actively practice this, eh? So like, there’s a co-production I want to have with a venue here—I haven’t been to a show at the venue in a while—and I need to ask them for something. And so it would be kind of rude for me, my personal feeling, if I was just like, “Yo, give me a letter of intent. I haven’t seen one of your shows in forever.” So you go to a show, you interact with them again, you show that you’re actually genuinely invested in what they do…

Michelle Lynne: Yes.

Adam Clarke: And then, you can ask and say, “Hey, listen. So by the way, we talked about doing a co-production for this thing. Uh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.” So that part of showing up, people know who you are. They trust you. They talk about you and ask questions with people that are related to them, that they already trust and I’ve worked with forever.

Uh, the next thing I would say is you have to start your own projects. I was fortunate enough to grow up with a mom who was an entrepreneur, as she ran her own business as a career counselor out of our house, and she was very successful. And when we were first starting as a band playing heavy metal, I was 13 or 14 and we wanted to record a demo, and what she did was instead of just bankrolling it—um, because she could have put like a thousand bucks in and, you know, whatever—she gave us her time. And what she taught me was how to go seek sponsors, how to put together a promotion plan. And she taught me how to do crowdfunding before crowdfunding online was even a thing. And I am so fortunate for that. So I get that folks might not have that background, and that’s really tough, but this is also why you should meet up with Michelle because she knows how to do it and the mastermind, and they can actually coach you on how to do this. And once people see the projects that you’re doing yourself, and you bring other people on board, those people that you brought on board, they’re going to mention your name to other people and folks are going to come see your projects and your performances. It might be five people in the first one, but it might be 500, two years later, you know,

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: I think those are two really, really important, actionable things.

Michelle Lynne: How beautiful of your mom, by the way, just to say, like, what a way to honor her as well, because that is so powerful what she did for you to actually teach you. I mean, it’s like “give a man a fish or teach a man to fish,” right? And now you’ve been able to build your career based on these fundaments that she taught you. That’s just so beautiful.

Adam Clarke: Yeah. Yeah. She had a very, very big impact on the way that I lead my life. Um, and this, ironically, the third part and the final part that I’ll say on, uh, actionable approaches is calculated risk. Now, not everyone can leave home—it might be a financial thing. It might be your family’s important for you. But for me, my mom died in 2015 and that was, it was terrible, but

Michelle Lynne: Yeah. I’m sorry.

Adam Clarke: It also gave me the permission to leave. And so I bought a one-way ticket to Germany and

Michelle Lynne: Hmm.

Adam Clarke: I’d already lived there before, and I spoke German, so it was fine, and it allowed me to take that risk of dropping myself somewhere brand new to start a career with nothing… I was, I was dirt poor. And I think, by taking this calculated risk to move to another country, and like moving to Belgium as well, and Germany as a Canadian citizen, you can just get an authenticity—this is your work permit. Like you snap your fingers, you say, “Speak German, there’s your job permit.” Belgium does not work like that at all. I had to, had to go through quite a stressful, stressful time with immigration in Belgium for about six years. It was, could only be self-employed as a composer…

Michelle Lynne: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Adam Clarke: So by being forced through circumstance to be successful in some way, you have to prove a certain amount of money. It helped my career develop. I took the risk of potentially being deported, being away from my family who are spread out all over Canada, and then by being forced into this situation and pushing through, it actually turned out so good. It sucked for so long. It was awful for a really long time…

Michelle Lynne: Yeah.

Adam Clarke: But it was worth it. And I feel like you have a very similar thing because you… off you went from Canada and you started a whole life and a career in the Netherlands. And I think, doing those things, you don’t have to move to a whole new country or something, you know, um, but taking calculated risks—maybe that risk is talking to that person you admire—just asking for their advice on something. I think those are three things that you should rather focus your time on than, uh, than these too good to be true opportunities. And that’s my two cents.

Michelle Lynne: Hmm. Adam, that was worth way more than two cents. Thank you for sharing that because I think what you have said is so important—showing that you are genuinely interested in being a contribution to someone’s project before you… it’s probably the most underlooked way to build what you said: trust, liking people. Of course, people want to help you if they know that you actually care and you’re not just in it for yourself. But most musicians do the pitch where it’s like, “Hi, here I am. Here’s what I play. Book me for the concert.” And it’s like, that is such a cold way to approach someone. So I love that you’re sharing about relationship. Thank you for what you shared about your mom, and also taking this calculated risk to Germany. I have a similar story of a calculated risk to Europe, the Netherlands. I basically protected myself by saying to my teacher in Montreal, “I’m coming back for the doctorate in two years, save my spot.” And he was like, “Yep, no problem. See you in two years.” You can do the doctorate, which was like a whole other crisis for me. But anyway, so I saved my apartment. I kept my grand piano. I had someone come in and sublet my apartment so that I could go back in two years. And I now, looking back, that was the way that I protected myself from this huge unknown—going across the ocean thing. And then finally, after I got here, it was like, “Okay, wait, like I can go to Italy on a plane. I’m going to stay for a bit longer and like see how, if I can figure this out.” Right. So, and then from there slowly, and of course, as you’re saying, things were very difficult for a long time and I had to figure out how to build in this new culture, and my beautiful little concert series has had ups and downs. But now it’s at a place where it’s like, “I’m so proud of having built something.” And then of course, TFA came into the mix. So, um, and the people that I met— I mean, I would never have met Deanna if I hadn’t been in Paris. So I, it’s just like, you can look back and see, like, “Wow, so many blessings come when you put yourself out of your comfort zone.” So whatever that means for people listening. And I really like your point about rather than going for these opportunities where someone’s going to swoop in and take care of you and get your concerts and, you know, all for the low price of 200 a month or whatever it is, it’s like, “Well, let’s just use your network. Use what’s in front of you. Talk to the people in your circles, be involved, be in the scene,” like you’re saying, and that is going to build better fruit and more stable than having some unknown person come in.

Thanks for sharing all that. I just want to touch also on your grant writing because I think for you that was such a way that you’ve been able to facilitate so many of your own projects and also other people’s, because now you’re writing grants for other artists, including us. We’re working together to send some grant applications to Canada Council so that I could go speak in Berlin this coming May at the Classical Next conference. So would you share a little bit about that?

Adam Clarke: Yeah, I’d love to. Um, well, this touches on bonus point, which is diversification, and that’s finding all the different sets of skills that you have and basically not putting all your eggs in one basket whilst you’re trying to grow this garden. You know, you need to put some attention everywhere. And so one of the things that I found I was good at: I’ve always been a decent creative writer, not in essay format or anything like that, but I was good with poetry. It was good with words and I was good at creating relationships between things. I know it sounds so vague, but it’s so important within grant writing.

Michelle Lynne: You’re a connector in real life with people and also a connector of words and ideas.

Adam Clarke: I started writing grants out of, “How the hell do I get money for projects that I want to do?” That’s the ultimate artist question: “Where the hell is the money coming from?”

Michelle Lynne: Exactly. Exactly.

Adam Clarke: And so I wrote this grant. We came up with this project with some colleagues in Bulgaria. Um, uh, Miko, a cellist friend of mine—he, um, so he brought me up to Bulgaria for a project, wrote a piece, and over dinner in Sofia, me and our colleagues—so me, Miko, Edgar, Bogdan, Angelina—said, “Hey, you know, Adam, you play bagpipes.” Yeah. And I’m like, “Yeah, I play bagpipes on the Bulgarian bagpipes, the Gaida.” Oh, that’s a pretty cool connection. What if we did a project where we played bagpipes? You know, hired three composers and did some sort of a cross-cultural thing. And so we created something called “Est West East West,” and it was a cross-cultural exchange between Bulgaria and Canada. We submitted the grant application. First grant I ever wrote, in like 2017, 2018—denied. I was like, so I was just finishing my master’s in 2018, and then I had three months to find a, um, it was illegal for me to get a job in Belgium. So I had to become self-employed.

Michelle Lynne: Okay…

Adam Clarke: You have to prove income. Um, and basically what happened was I got denied and then I was being evaluated for self-employment. So I was about to be deported, and then Canada Council’s like, “Hey, listen, we changed our mind. Here’s 40,000.” It’s like, yes.

Michelle Lynne: What?

Adam Clarke: God bless

Michelle Lynne: That’s

Adam Clarke: the

Michelle Lynne: wild.

Adam Clarke: Council for the Arts.

Michelle Lynne: They changed their mind? I’ve never heard of that before.

Adam Clarke: I think someone wasn’t able to go through with their grants. So how it works is, like, you submit a bunch of grants, then they choose a bunch of them that meet the criteria. And then there’s a ranking system. We can fund 10 and if you’re number 11, well,

Michelle Lynne: Okay.

Adam Clarke: we were number 11 and then 10 was like, “Whoops, I can’t do this.” And so we became number 10…

Michelle Lynne: Amazing.

Adam Clarke: That was beautiful. And so that’s how that whole

Michelle Lynne: 40Ks. That’s no joke. That’s a serious amount of money.

Adam Clarke: Yeah, well, it goes away very quickly when you work with a lot of people, right? So like,

Michelle Lynne: Yeah. Right.

Adam Clarke: if you work on a large project with folks… Pro tip: if you are writing grants, you should be aware that starting small is sometimes a good idea, because things get very expensive very quickly, especially when you have to travel with eight people and a cello. Don’t travel with a cello. It’s a nightmare. But basically, um, so I write grants quite often. I’m working on about six grants at the moment right now, all for myself because I finished the yours and the, also,

Michelle Lynne: You did.

Adam Clarke: the piano duo album that we’re planning to do together. Uh, if anyone here is listening and they need grant writing done, Michelle and I are great friends, so I’m making a deal for folks that go through her: y’all will get an hour-long conversation with me. We can talk through your project. I can give you some advice on how you might go about getting funding. And it’s not just about grant writing. I can also teach you a little bit about how to develop a network and develop your co-producers, ‘cause co-producers are vital to a successful grant application. And then if you guys want me to write your grant with you or for you, then that’s something that we’re—my colleague, Leah, and I are doing together in partnership with Fearless Artists Mastermind.

Michelle Lynne: Yes. Yeah, that’s one of our new offers. We’re going to be offering grant writing services through Adam, through the Fearless Artists. So that is a super generous offer. Thank you, Adam, so much. So if you’re listening, you’re curious about what it would look like to have a grant written for you. You want a consultation, just get in touch with Adam. And, uh, yeah, I just want to thank everybody for sending in your scams. Thank you, Adam, for coming on today for this great episode, all the wisdom that you shared. And I particularly love the action points that you shared earlier. I think my favorite one is probably just showing up and being part of the scene and showing that you’re a genuine contributor before you make the ask. And I think that’s how I’ve managed to build my network is by hyping people up for like five years on Instagram before saying, “By the way, we have a membership. Do you want to join?” Which is when, you know, I actually hyped them up even more. If anyone else has any good scams for the next part two of this episode, uh, let us know in the future and thanks, everybody, for listening. Make sure you go follow Adam. Where can we find you?

Adam Clarke: Instagram, Adam V Clark with an E on the end, and/or adamvclark.com.

Michelle Lynne: Awesome. Adam, thanks so much for joining today. And thanks, everybody, for listening. If you screenshot this and share it to your Stories, tag us, and we will reshare, and we’ll see you next time at the Fearless Artist. Be fearless.